a research question

From: Justin Moschetti

Dear editor of The Multiracial Activist:

I am a student at Southern Oregon University. I am doing research for a project about interracial marriage laws in the United States. I am of Sicilian descent, and I remember my mother telling me about how she vaguely recalls reading about a court case in America before interracial marriage laws were struck down. This case involved a couple that was being prosecuted for breaking the interracial marriage laws in their state. One of the spouse members was white and the other was black.

However, the white spouse was Sicilian and somehow was able to use the defense that Sicilian people have a rich ethnic heritage separate from other Italians, which includes African and Arab blood. Even though this ethnic mixing was slight, according to the one drop rule of that time the white spouse was considered black by the court.

My mother’s information about the case “who, what, where, when, etc.” ends there and for a long time I did not believe such a case was possible. However, I mentioned it to someone else once, and they too seemed to vaguely remember hearing that Sicilians were considered multi-ethnic because of the ethnic mixing throughout their history.

I have been searching the internet for any proof of such a case actually existing, but have so far found nothing. When I came upon your website I thought a group with your knowledge about interracial marriage laws and court battles might know what I am talking about.

I appreciate any information you could provide or suggestions of where to look for information. Thank you for your time.

Justin Moschetti.

Editor: That’s one case I’m vague about on the details. Perhaps one of this blog’s readers will have that answer for Mr. Moschetti.


  1. I remember hearing about this case and remember reading about it.
    If I’m able to find the link, I’ll post it here.

  2. ARE ITALIANS WHITE?In Rollins v. Alabama (1922), as we have seen, a Sicilian woman was not deemed “white” enough by an Alabama court to legally prevent a “black” man from mating with her. Italians in Louisiana were also deemed unworthy of full “whiteness” and its privileges.

    Many Italians are quite swarthy, olive or even brown-skinned. This is not surprising, given Italy’s geographical closeness to Africa. In 1891 a “white” Louisiana mob lynched 11 Italians, What made Italians non-white in their eyes despite their immigration to the U.S. as “free white persons”? Jacobson says that Italians did not “act white” by Southern standards. They socialized freely with “blacks” and worked at “black” jobs. They also supported Republican and Populist political candidates. I would like to inquire as to whether many of these “blacks” were in fact mixed-race Creoles. Physically, Italians and Creoles are very similar. Culturally, they are both Roman Catholic and “Latin.” Since Jacobson says that Italians intermarried with “blacks,” I have to suggest that these mates were probably not “black” at all but Creole.

    From: Whiteness of a Different Color: European Immigrants and the Alchemy of Race by Matthew Frye Jacobson. Harvard University Press, 1998.


    3/5/2004 6:44:13 PM

  3. this is a question i have been wondering about for some time. I’m obviously italian and alot of people ask me if im puerto rican. my skin is darker than the average white persons but my grandparents are both really dark. alot of people say i’m not white but when i say that to some white people, they say im a lyer. I don’t really know about this. If anyone knows for sure, could u tell me?

    4/6/2004 8:54:51 PM

  4. I am of Sicilian descent, and 2nd generation American, and I am of olive/dark complexion and living now in the southern U.S. (grew up in Philly) I am commonly taken as Creole or light skinned black. This is especially true with my black wavy hair and broad nose. Some people do not believe me when I tell them I am not Puerto Rican or bi-racial. I am not offended either way, because I am proud of my ancestry and embrace all of the ethnic composition that is within my Siclian background, the African, Arab and Spanish intertwined throughout the years. My black friends insist I am “one of them” and my few white friends are envious, because I do not burn in the sun, and women of all races dig me. Hey, they dig the green eyes on a dark skinned cat, so I run with it!

  5. Don’t buy the hype about Sicilians having an African and Arab heritage. That belief is based on race-politics and ignorance. Genetically, there’s no evidence for it. Take a look at this:

    You can find more scientific information about Italians, other southern Europeans, the origin of skin color, and many related topics on this website:


    Oh, and next time someone says you look Hispanic, remind them that ‘Hispanic’ isn’t a race, and that many Latin Americans are largely, if not entirely, of southern European descent. So rather, it’s the Hispanics who often look like you, not the other way around.

  6. I find your comments very interesting. I happen to be black and I am very interested in Italian culture. I din;t know that so many were discriminated on in the south (I’m from Florida) ans were cnsidered black? What about in New york and in other New England states? Did they marry other blacks up there as well?

  7. I am a Sicilian-CANADIAN and I feel verys trongly about my culture,
    First of all, I am quite dark in colour (about the same as Jennifer Lopez) , despite the fact that I live in Canada, and I have thick, nearly black hair.

    The first comment I want to make is on this whole “Hispanic” race issue. I agree with the person who said that Hispanic is NOT a race on its own, because this is TRUE. Latin Americans have CREATED a race for themselves simply because of the fact that they speak an identical language. However, I must DISAGREE with the same person who said that most Latinos are of Southern European decent…this is definitely NOT true. MANY latin american countries have a very large section of their population which is MESTIZO, which is a Southern European and Amerindian mix, making them of mixed culture.

    As for Sicilians, we are all CAUCASOIDS due to our Skull Structure, but we most definitely are NOT completely White. The facts state that we have Arab (including North Africa), Greek, and Spanish blood running through our veins, but what ultimately makes us caucasoid is the fact that Arabs, Spaniards, and Greeks all have a similar skull structure that makes them CAUCASOID TOO.

    Sicilians = Caucasoid
    Sicilians ARE NOT WHITE

    7/13/2004 4:43:53 PM

  8. >>> I must DISAGREE with the same person who said that most Latinos are of Southern European decent…this is definitely NOT true.
    I didn’t say “most”, I said “many”. It depends on the country really. See this page:


    Also, note that a Mestizo can be anywhere from 10% to 90% European:


    >>> As for Sicilians, we are all CAUCASOIDS due to our Skull Structure, but we most definitely are NOT completely White.

    “White” is a confusing and politicized term whose meaning varies. In anthropology it’s simply a synonym for “Caucasoid”. In colloquial usage it means “of European descent”. It can also mean “fair-skinned” regardless of race. I’m not even sure how you’re using it right now, but I myself try to avoid it altogether.

    >>> The facts state that we have Arab (including North Africa), Greek, and Spanish blood running through our veins

    Not entirely accurate. The link I posted regarding this issue is dead, but here’s the same information on a new page:


  9. Someone said: “I’m obviously italian and a lot of people ask me if im puerto rican. ”
    I am Puertorrican and a white one. There is a big miscoception about puertorricans and the rest of the “latinos”. I live in Florida and when I say that I am puertorrican the people usually say: “I though you were white”. Well… I am white. There are white puertorricans (from mostly spanish and also italians, corsicans, french…) black puertorricans and mulatto puertorricans. In fact white puertorricans are the mayority in Puerto Rico, if you don’t believe me either go to Puerto Rico (the country side of the island) or check the U.S. Census


    7/24/2004 9:32:07 PM

  10. Here are two recently published books that may be of interest:
    ARE ITALIANS WHITE? HOW RACE IS MADE IN AMERICA, ed. Jennifer Guglielmo (New York and London: Routledge, 2003)

    Thomas A. Guglielmo. White on Arrival: Italians, Race, Color, and Power in Chicago, 1890–1945. New York: Oxford University Press. 2003

  11. I am 100% Sicilian and people always come up to me asking me if I’m Arabic! I’m darker than the average person, I don’t burn in the sun, and my hair is really dark, thick and wavy. I’ve gotten so many people speaking in foreign languages to me. Urdi, Hindi, Arabic, Spanish, you name it. On a side note, a lot of people don’t realize Sicilians tend to separate themselves from the other Italians. We are a whole different island with people who look, think, have different views on life, and act differently. Although, Sicilians can come in a variety of colors! My great great grandmother was blonde and blue eyed, but she had wonderful, wonderful tan skin like the rest of my family. Sicilian is actually a language far different than Italian! Assa binidica a tutti.

    8/5/2004 1:55:50 PM

  12. Is it only Sicilians that have Arab, Greek, and Spanish blood in them or is it other Italians too. Because I’m of Calabrese descent (southern Italy) and so many people mistaken me for puerto rican. I’m really not dark skinned but I do have the dark hair and dark eyes and many people say that I have the peurto rican features.

  13. ::: AUDRA DI FALCO SAID: “I am 100% Sicilian and people always come up to me asking me if I’m Arabic!”
    No they don’t. Stop lying.

    First of all, people don’t just come up to other people in the street and ask them if they’re a certain ethnicity. That’s lie number one.

    Second of all, you might get asked if you’re Hispanic or Jewish, or something else that’s common and often looks Southern European, but not Arabic. That’s lie number two.

    I might buy the “talking to you in other languages” part, if you were in some foreign country at the time, and really tanned because it was summer. But even that seems far fetched.

    Who do you think you’re kidding?

    ::: LAU SAID: “Is it only Sicilians that have Arab, Greek, and Spanish blood in them or is it other Italians too.”

    All Southern Italians are descended from Greeks and Romans. They don’t have any Arab or Spanish blood.

    ::: LAU SAID: “I’m really not dark skinned but I do have the dark hair and dark eyes and many people say that I have the peurto rican features.”

    There’s no such thing as “Puerto Rican features.” Some PRs look white, some look Indian, some look black, and some look like different mixes.

  14. Interesting page. I have only come to realize how many people are interested in this subject. Honestly, it does miff me. My ancestry is Greek-Italian-Sicilian (notice I DO list Sicilian as separate). Growing up in Los Angeles, I never had anyone question my “whiteness.” I have a medium light complexion (although my face and arms tan easily), dark brown, wavy hair, and blue eyes. My features look Greek, to be honest. It was only later that I noticed some people saying that southern Europeans are caucasians, but not all of them were “white.” I began to notice for the first time that there WERE some people of “Italian” ancestry that were swarthy, with very curly hair, etc., but these seemed to be in the minority. When I asked Italians/ItalAmericans where there families came from, it was the southerners who often fit the above description. My experience has been that most Italian people look very European, not North African (whatever that really means, since some of them are very white looking, especially in Tunisia). As to the prevelance of Arab and North African blood in southern Italians, I believe it, judging not only by some of their features, but by history itself. There was intermingling in ancient times, although how much is up to speculation. Yet if you look at photographs of Italians from Italy, you will usually, again, see very European (white)looking people, especially from the central and northern parts. I think that underlying this prejudicial thinking is the false idea that a “white” person looks nothern European, a false assumption not found in Latin America (or Africa or Asia for that matter). Suffice to say that if I were to visit one of the former Italian colonies in Africa, the populace would have no problem in identifying me as a white man. Enough said.
    As to other comments made on this page, yes Latino is not a race. In South America, Italians, Spaniards, and Portuguese are always labeled as white (along with French and Romanian). In Mexico and Central America, the majority are mestizo, (mixed white and Indian). In the Caribbean, there are whites (many Cubans, for example), mulattoes (many, but not all Puerto Ricans), blacks, Chinese, etc. Yet to deny that there is an Hispanic “type” is also to deny reality. Most of the Hispanics in the south-west U.S. are mestizo, while those from the north-east and Florida run from white to black to mulatto.

    Anyway, going back to Europeans, there is no “pure” race or ethnic group; all have intermingled with others to one extent or another. Let’s just remember that and accept each other as physical brothers and sisters.

  15. I am of Sicilian and Italian decent.. what Mike said was infact wrong, people who are of other mixed races do come up and ask me all the time what i am because of my skin color.. it’s a minority thing, they tend to feel freely to discuss thing among one another, that they won’t discuss with caucassions.. people from all of southern italy are mixed with arab and northern african, not just Sicily.. it’s nice that you like to think South italy wasn’t, but in reality, it was.. The whole south was looked down upon from the north and hated, the north could care less about the people, and over time they eventually all became mixed.. what are you people talking about saying southern italians are of lighter complexion? I’ve never seen it.. and if you do, these peoples roots are obviously not from southern italy.. everyone from southern italy is of darker complexion, in other words.. put a few southern italians next to Tony Blair, George Bush, and William Clinton, and you can clearly see they are 2 different races of people.. what makes minorties are their culture, heritage, and most of all color.. it’s not a white color, and it’s not tan, it’s darker then that.. i’ve seen white people who tan, it’s nothing like how dark i can get..
    “Second of all, you might get asked if you’re Hispanic or Jewish, or something else that’s common and often looks Southern European, but not Arabic. That’s lie number two.”

    are you serious? everybody and their mother knows italians are arabic.. i mean you people can go on every statistic you find, in any book you wanna look.. but the fact is, most of them are bullshit, and you have to compare by facial features to get the real ancestry.. who do these people look like most? i definately don’t think it would be the WASPs.. if you do, then you need to stop smoking crack..

    “All Southern Italians are descended from Greeks and Romans. They don’t have any Arab or Spanish blood.”

    if anything italians have more arab in them, then spanish or anything else.. although there is a good amount of spanish, the arabic is dominant and more so in the blood then anything else.. the north west african blood is also present to..

    8/28/2004 3:25:07 PM

  16. i am sicilian and i know that that is a nationality. i have dark skin and sure i could look like i am something else quote on quote but what it somes down to is WE ARE ALL HUMAN BEINGS AND WE ARE ALL MIXED UP!!!and thats what i love about people! i’m sure i have some african blood in me and some ….well any other kind of blood….but the point is we are all human beings and at some time we all looked the same so its doesnt matter whether i am black or white or mixed or native american or whatever or japanese etc. cuz no one really knows exactly where they are from if u go way back…..yeah i am sicilian but u never knows where my family moved from way back in the day. WE ARE ALL HUMAN AND WE SHOULD EMBRACE OUR DIFFERENCES AND ALSO EMBRACE HOW MUCH OF WHAT WE HAVE IN COMMON…..THERE IS NO NEED TO TRY AND DITINGUISH DIFF PEOPLE ….FUCK SCIENCE W/ALL THAT BLOOD SHIT WE ARE ALL HUMAN BLOOD!!!!

    8/29/2004 4:50:33 AM

  17. Mike, you’re wrong about that, b/c people ask me all the time, “What are you?” Or they immediately assume that I’m Cuban, Dominican, whatever, & start talking to me in a foreign language (English is my only language). Complete strangers. I have pale skin, dark hair, dark eyes, delicate features that bewilder many people…why, I could be just about anything! My nationality is 100% American, but I am multiracial: Jamaican/Carribean, Black, Scottish, Finnish, Swiss, Syrian. So it isn’t a lie, it does happen to some folks. I wonder what ethnicity/nationality you identify with, since you claim that Audra is lying. You haven’t presented any facts to back up what you said. I tend to believe her statement, b/c it is certainly true that Sicilians come in a variety of colors & looks…just like “whites”, “blacks”, etc.
    Wendell, you said you are a “white Puerto Rican.” I’m not saying this to offend anyone, however Latin people are not white people, per se. Most are actually a mixture of races. Someone here was correct in saying that Latins run the gamut from being white in appearance (most likely those with roots in Spain, since that is part of Europe), to being black or mixed with the blood of Arabic people & natives. I live in Miami, where there is an overwhelming population of Cubans & Puerto Ricans who consider themselves to be 100% white. This is incorrect, as very few of them have European blood in their veins. They are mostly mixed with African, Arabic, or Native American. There are a few with French & Spanish backgrounds. And on another note, most American whites do not think of these people as “white” either…they simply think of them as being “non-white” or “Hispanic.”

    Lee, I’m with you. Much of what you said was logical & fair. Italian-Guy, there is some truth to what you said. MOST southern Italians tend to have a swarthy olive skin & curly hair, however it doesn’t hold true for all. There are a few rare types with light skin & eyes. Blondes are very rare in that part of Italy, but there are a few. From what I’ve read, some Italians are descendants of Greeks & Romans, while others are descendants of the Moors. The Moors were also a mixed people: Northern African & Arabic. They had bronzed skin & darker coloring. So that might explain the difference in coloring in some Italians & Sicilians. I don’t know about Spanish people being the same as Italians, but since Spain & Italy are both in Europe, maybe there was some interbreeding.

    This is an interesting subject worth looking into, but as a few people here said, there are no pure races left in the world today. There is a lot of interbreeding, so people cannot really label one another anymore (which is good!), try as they might. I couldn’t tell you the last time I saw a genuine blue-eyed blonde with pale skin here in the United States, maybe not since the late 1980’s. Different looks are cropping up everywhere. People just need to chill out & accept diversity.

    8/31/2004 14:16

  18. I am of mixed italian/sicilian background and contrary to mikes beliefs I have been asked maybe not literally in the street but from lots of people I meet in life who are curious to know “what” I am. If I have them guess I usually am mistaken for hispanic. Sicilians are actually much like puerto ricans in that yes there are some of us who are mostly white and some who are very dark skinned and others like myself who would be somewhere in the middle. Lots of sicilians including myself could easily fit into a group of arabs if we were only judging on looks. The word white gets thrown around meaning different things when talking about different things. If you just go by white meaning caucasian then arabs are considered white and the U.S. government classifies the people originating from the middle east as white as well but most people in every day walk of life would not. So while Sicilians may be mostly caucasian they do have a mixed background of southern european as well as soom arab and african which makes a diverse people much like the hispanics of the caribbean and south america.

  19. ok when will one of yall sicilians or southern italians just admit u have some african blood in u. its a reason why u have olive skin, dark hair, dark eye,etc. And stop referring North Africa as if black ppl don’t still live there! Arabs there too, but its still black africans and black arabs and full blooded arabs there. but some of yall are dark then some of the arabs…hum… remember hannibal was a nubian. who conquer italy for 15 years, so think about this. he brought he family up there, his men his troops, his troops women, and mingle with the native italians. just admit to it be proud of your african blood. i mean my great-great grandfather is white ass snow. an irish man. but if u look at me u would never know that. because i’m dark as Wesley snipes, the actor. and if u don’t know who he is…ok me and Micheal Jordan have the same complexion. And majority of black ppl in america is the same way…having white blood in us and/or indian. but we dont boast it around the world as much and let ppl know due to the fact …we still black REGARDLESS…thats what yall see…and thats the way it is. Am i ashame of my irish heritage…NO! or having white blood NO! But its messed up when the tables are turn. when a white person have black blood in them they scared to tell the world for whatever reason. I went to school with an italian, who look very dark to be classified as a white man, but anyway one day we was talking about race and he told me “Italians aint nothing but black people turn inside out.” He know his roots and not ashame of it and so should you all!!! When yall came over here, the “white people” didn’t consider yall “white people”. they call you all “degos” i dont know if i’m spelling it right but thats just like calling a black person a nigger! and in Italy, northern italians joke with southern italians because they have “african blood”. thats just like a dark skin black person, joking with a light skin black person, saying ” oh you got white blood in you” in conclusion…lol…SAY IT LOUD, U GOT BLACK BLOOD IN YOU AND BE PROUD!

    9/4/2004 2:45:35 AM

  20. The level of discussion in this thread has really degenerated since I was last here. It’s nothing but people who don’t know what they’re talking about making the same unsupported claims over and over again. Try reading the links I’ve been providing. They contain relevant scientific and historical information that can clear up many of the misconceptions being perpetuated here.





    ^^^^^ They’re the most genetically pure ethnic group in Europe (you’ll be surprised when you see them).




  21. Hi, I am Zachary. I was reading the messages on this website. I myself am half Italian (proud of it by the way). I consider Italians, and Sicilians the same thing. So, if I say Italians, I am also reffering to Sicilians.
    I don’t know if anyone will agree, or disagree. But, this is my opinion. I had no idea that there were these many multiethnic comments, and topics, and all kinds of things about Italians. I also think it’s kind of rediculous. But, here are my opinions about Italians.

    The truth is, a very big majority of Italians have darker eyes, darker hair, and darker skin than most other white people. And, believe me I have several black people ask me if I am black. But, because, I don’t really look black I say no. I look more Puerto Rican than anything. My mother is 100% Italian.

    And, my mother does look like a medium skinned African American. If you didn’t know my mom, you would think she was half black. At least right now. Because, in the winter she gets slightly lighter in skin. But, that kind of stuff is really typical of all Italians.

    Because Sicily is just right south of Italy, Sicily has always been like a crossroad althroughtout history for foriegn people to come into Italy. And many Aricans, Arabs, and Greeks did come into both Italy, and Sicily to make thier own dwellings. And, that is highly evident in Sicily’s physical features. There are so many locations in Sicily that have so many left behind influences of multicultural traces. And, the Sicilian dialect of Italian itself has slight traces of Arab in it.

    I’d say Italians have a mix of mainly African, and Greek. While Sicilians have a mix of both of those plus Arab. There might be slight traces of Arab blood on Italian DNA. But, I am not sure. Now, I saw an article that said Italians have Spanish blood.

    I’ve never ever heard of that before. That sounds very unlikely. But, I do believe Italians do have African in them. And, as a half Italian kid, I myself have never taken on a full “white” identity. There is a French kid in my class.

    In the summer time, I look nearly 3 times darker than him. Now, in the summer time, I do burn because I am only half Italian. But, I only burn once. After that, it’s all stricktly tanning for me. I have other “Caucasion” frineds who either burn half the summer time, or never tan at all.

    Also, I have very dark, and very bushy eyebrows. My eyebrows are probably just slightly thinner than Saddam Huseins eyebrows. And, if I don’t do anything, I’ll also grow a unibrow. Now, you all are probably thinking what does this have to do with the topic. Well, this is why I brought it up.

    If you study males closely, 95% of the men worldwide who tend to have bushy eyebrows, and grow unibrows are Latin American, and middle eastern men (no specific for Latin American men, but of the middle eastern men Arabian, Arabic, Jewish, ETC). They are the main men who tend to have bushy eyebrows, and grow unibrows. Most of them are all non-white. And, noone can say I am wrong. Because, it’s obvious.

    Well, if I am all white, expalin to me why I have bushy eyebrows, and grow a unibrow? It isn’t because I am German, or French, or Dutch, or English. Italian is the only thing I have in me that the country lies that close to Africa, and the middle east. If you could see me, I think I am 25% good enough proof that Italians do in fact have both African, and middle eastern ancestry in them. So, in conclusion, everything I’ve studied in the past…

    And, all the stuff I’ve read, and all the different opinions of people… I would say that it is a fact to say that most, or all Italians are only 25, to 50% white. Because, for us Italians… we do have features, and characteristics in us, and in our blood, and DNA that make us well separated from ever being fully white.

    9/5/2004 4:21:09 PM

  22. I’m with Zachary for the most part. Most Italians are well-known for their thick dark hair & variety of skin tones. Actress Sophia Loren comes to mind, with her Roman nose & olive skin. Madonna is Italian, but has been bleaching her hair ever since “Blonde Ambition.” Jenna Jameson is Italian, with naturally mousy hair that’s bleached blonde. Christina Ricci is Italian, as are Monica Bellucci & Annabella Sciorra (she was in that movie “Jungle Fever.”) These women vary in looks, but they are all Italian.

    Zachary is also very correct in saying that most Italians have darker hair & eyes than other Europeans. It’s a Mediterranean look. Italians are not completely white, although a few look more European, as I said before. There are variations among ALL groups of people. That’s the reason there are high-yellow, caramel, redbone, blue-black people of African origin. That’s the reason that not every white person has blonde hair or blue/green eyes, there are many full-blooded whites with dark hair & eyes, particularly in predominantly white states like Maine or Vermont, where there is almost NO racial mixing of any kind. To “Black Man”, although I agree with some of what you’re saying, I don’t completely understand.

    I’m sure that there are Italians who are unaware of any African blood in their ancestry…maybe that’s why they don’t “admit” it? Of course, this isn’t always the case, but it does happen. As I said above, it is possible to have dark hair & dark eyes and still have no black heritage whatsoever. It’s not something we normally associate with white people, but not all white people are blond with light eyes. I’m neither Sicilian nor Italian, but I’ve known many of them & their looks were quite varied. There are black Italians, brown Italians, fair Italians. Some were clearly mixed, others were definitely not. Some people acknowledge their “roots” if they are in fact mixed with something & they should! I agree that people should accept whatever they’re mixed with. However, not everyone feels that way about it. Racial identity is something that people in the United States are PC about, & it’s a touchy subject for many, understandably. If somebody admits to having had a black ancestor, okay. And if they don’t, that’s okay too. It’s their business & they have their reasons, although it seems deceptive. And as a mixed woman who looks 100% White, I can tell you this: I have met black people in denial who love to boast about their so-called white mother or light-skinned family members, & then it turns out to be completely false. I know a few blacks who are very ashamed to be black. I don’t like it either, but it happens, & people have their reasons.

    “Dago” was an offensive term hurled at Italians in America until the mid-1960s. It was also heard in some parts of Europe & Australia. Do you know why Italians weren’t considered “white” in America for a while? Because their behavior was unconventional by American standards. They spoke their own language, prepared interesting dishes, & associated with blacks. Most of them were poor. The Italians I’ve seen in historical photos look completely European, but because they were friendly with blacks & didn’t speak the language of racist white America, they were shunned by other whites. You forget that even white folks have their own roots. I look at it this way, black people may be born in any part of the world, but their primary bloodline reaches back to Africa. A white person from Georgia or Florida or Anywhere, USA almost certainly had ancestors come over on the Mayflower from England or they have roots in Germany, Ireland, Scotland, the UK, Sweden, Denmark, or the Soviet Union. Whew…I apologize for my long post, but I just thought I’d offer my perspectives on this interesting topic. We’re all human, any way you look at it! *smile*

    9/5/2004 20:20

  23. I am writing to mention the Black Madonnas of the world including Our Lady of Tindari, located in the northeastern region of Italy. It is amazing to know that so many of these black madonnas have been found from Mexico to Italy! What does this mean? It means that there are African influences throughout the world. I am black Cuban, Puerto Rican and Swedish. Even amongst my fellow latinos there is racism. There are different shades of skin,ranging from snow white to the bluest-black. Historically speaking latinos are comprised of a mix of indian, african, and spaniard influences. Genetics plays a role, a sort of lotto, as to which physical traits will be expressed and which ones will not. In my research of Italy, I have discovered that there is sufficient evidence to determine Sicilians to be racially diverse. Africa is Africa–the dark continent, no matter which country, including Egypt. Many of the features consistent in many of the Sicilian people, bronze coloring, thicker-textured hair, and broader features can be traced to the African(Arab)conquests brought about by Hamilcar and the Moors in southern Italy. I have read countless accounts of history, especially concerning race, and there seems to be a preponderance of denial on the part of many white historians. Do not believe something because it is convenient for you. It is what it is. I also suggest to you, the readers to research sickle cell anemia within the Sicilian population. The sickled blood cell originated in Africa as a form of protection for the indigenous people against malaria (typically found in tropical regions). What is the connection? Genes–we share in the same gene pool as those who have this trait or disease. You see, not only is there constructed historical research to support African lineage within Sicilians, there is also genetic evidence. Africa, though stricken with poverty and sickness in some countries, is an absolutely beautiful and rich continent. There is such a lushness in culture-music, dance, customs, religion. What is there not to like about it? This “dark” continent is home to copious sources of diamonds, oil, and gold. The indigenous people are beautiful shades of brown, rich in melanin and diversity. I say all this to say that selected, powerful individuals with control in writing history and related literature have determined Africa and blackness to be bad because of their fear of what is different and unfamiliar. Instead of taking time to understand and tolerate differences, historians poisoned the public/society with lies that black is abominable. Think about it–black-listed, black-balled, black-market, black plague, black-mailed, black angel, black death, etc…These words all have negative connotations with foreboding, dark, evil consequences.
    Sicilian people are beautiful, rich in cultural diversity which should be embraced. I think Sicilian men are extremely handsome with such a deep coloring and represent such a wealth in diversity. If you are Sicilian, please do additional research. Be bold enough to truthfully know your history. And don’t be made to feel inadequate because of your background. You are truly blessed culturally and spiritually.

  24. Italy, and Sicily both sit in the Mediterranean sea. Like I said: Sicily because of where it is located, has always been like a crossroad for Africa, and the middle east all through history. And, many exploerers, travelers, and invaders came in and occupied both countries for many years. And, they settled down in the two lands. And, with settling in other countries comes mixing with the natives of the land.
    And, the fact is, most Italians not only because of Italy’s location. But, also because of invasion, Italians do have darker hair, darker eyes, and darker skin. (due to a mixing of blood in thier DNA). The main reasons why Italians have dark skin, eyes, and hair is because of Italy’s location, and because of the mixing of blood they have. And, also… I never said bushy eyebrows are found in African DNA.

    Nor did I say that other Europeans didn’t have bushy eyebrows. My exact words were “It’s mainly Latin American, and middle eastern men that have bushy eyebrows”. Yes, there are other races, and ethnicities in this word with bushy eyebrows. But, it’s most commonly found in those men. And, about the black issue. That’s true.

    In the summer, I do get dark enough to be mistaken for either a light skinned black, or a Puerto Rican. Now, my mother whom is 100% Italian really does look black. Her hair is what makes her look more Arab than anything, though. Since I don’t know how to spell her real name. For those of you who saw The GodFather, my mother’s hair looks like Connie’s hair. And, for those who saw The GodFather part 3.

    In the third sequal, let’s be honest, Connie didn’t look anything white. She looked like she was right from Saudi Arabia. She had dark, dark hair with blue reflections in it, a dark olive skin color, and she dressed like a Muslim, always putting that little robe over her head, and face. For those of you who saw the GofFather part 3, you’ll know what I am talking about.

    But, this is not a movie conversation. That’s just the closest thing I can compare my mother’s physical features to. So, in conclusion, I think I can truthfully say I do know what I am talking about. Now, who agrees, and who disagrees?

    9/6/2004 2:26:49 PM

  25. i know this is off the subject butPUNCH JUDY:
    AUGUST 31 COMMENT you said there is no such thing called a white latino. So is there a such thing called a black latino? Pele’ the soccer player from brazil know he is latino, but will be quick to tell u how pride he is to be a black man. by the way look up argentina history. u’ll find WHITE people living there blonde hair, blue eyes. yeah they came from germany and settle there in the 1800’s but they white. having they on communities. and nooo i never been to argentina but my spanish teacher from h/s told me this. and yes she’s white. And thats true some puerto rican and cubans claim to be white. cuz they are “white-latinos”. I give u an example Ricky Martin the singer is a white-latino. In the United States he’ll be a “latino”. but in puerto rico he’ll be a “white latino”. That one singer Shakira i don’t know if u know her but she is a pop singer from columbia. she will fall in the same category.

    9/6/2004 6:05:47 AM

  26. @ Zachary:

    >>> The truth is, a very big majority of Italians have darker eyes, darker hair, and darker skin than most other white people.

    So? Do you understand anything about climate and adaptation? Northern Europe is cold, so the white people ther

  27. >>> The main reasons why Italians have dark skin, eyes, and hair is because of Italy’s location, and because of the mixing of blood they have.
    Nope. It’s all evolution and natural variation, as I explained above. Italians don’t have mixed blood:


    >>> Nor did I say that other Europeans didn’t have bushy eyebrows.

    You implied that bushy eyebrows came from mixing with Arabs and Africans. They don’t.

    >>> In the summer, I do get dark enough to be mistaken for either a light skinned black, or a Puerto Rican.

    Yes, that process is called tanning, and it has absolutely nothing to do with racial ancestry:


    >>> Her hair is what makes her look more Arab than anything

    There’s no such thing as “Arab hair.” Arabs can have straight, wavy or curly hair just like Europeans. And Europeans can have dark hair just like Arabs.

    >>> she dressed like a Muslim, always putting that little robe over her head, and face.

    Those are known as head scarves, and they’re worn throughout Europe, mainly by peasants, from Russia to Germany to Italy. Or perhaps it was a black veil and the character was supposed to be in mourning. Either way, it obviously wasn’t “Muslim”. A Christian woman wouldn’t dress like a Muslim.

    >>> I can truthfully say I do know what I am talking about

    When you’re able to back up your assertions with hard evidence, then you can brag about knowing what you’re talking about. But until then…sorry.



    9/7/2004 4:59:46 PM

  29. First, the concepts of “whiteness” and “blackness” are socio-political concepts having absolutely no scientific validity. If an anthropologist were to comment on this, she’d say that the skin of human beings ranges in a continuous spectrum from very dark (generally in geographical areas bordering the equator) to very light or no melanism (albino) (generally in geographical areas to the far north). Most likely, skin tone reflects genetic changes to the exposure to ultraviolet (UV) light striking the earth’s surface. Darker pigmentation is more suitable as protection against increased amounts of UV light which generally occur in the the regions bordering the equator, whereas in the far north little UV light reaches the surface so lack of melanin in the skin improves absorption of the little UV radiation available (necessary for Vitamin D production).
    Re skin color, one should be proud of whatever skin color one has. Scientifically, there is remarkably little variation between human DNA regardless of what human is taken from a random sample of any human population. In fact, if you want to be humble about the whole thing, human DNA and chimpanzee DNA differs by only about 2.5% of the entire genome. Put another way, genetically 97.5% of “us” is the same as found in a chimp!

  30. >>> It still boggles my mind how you would ever be able to explain Sicily being occupied by various people for thousands upon thousands of years, yet the population remiained ‘pure’.
    I never said “pure”. Italians, Spaniards and Frenchmen have small amounts (about 1 to 2%) of recent North African DNA, which attests to the presence of Moors in their countries. The point is that mixing was at a minimum for the cultural reasons already stated, and not nearly enough to make any modern European racially “Moorish”.

  31. italians are not part black…
    Please remember that even if northern africans did went into sicily, they were white!

    Northern africa is allmoust white!
    some tribes are WHITE!
    believe it or not!

    And if they did went there, they were not that much people invading sicily from north africa!

    Hispanics is another misconceptions!
    hispanics are not a race…
    there are indians hispanics, White hispanics and mulattos hispanics.
    If you think that latin or hispanic is a race…then you must be all crazy!

    9/11/2004 9:16:26 PM

  32. This post is in regards to a comment made by Mike, re: a previous post of mine.. Below is what he said, critiquing my post, with my rebuttal. Enjoy.
    ::: AUDRA DI FALCO SAID: “I am 100% Sicilian and people always come up to me asking me if I’m Arabic!”

    No they don’t. Stop lying.

    First of all, people don’t just come up to other people in the street and ask them if they’re a certain ethnicity. That’s lie number one.

    Second of all, you might get asked if you’re Hispanic or Jewish, or something else that’s common and often looks Southern European, but not Arabic. That’s lie number two.

    I might buy the “talking to you in other languages” part, if you were in some foreign country at the time, and really tanned because it was summer. But even that seems far fetched.

    Who do you think you’re kidding?

    ::: First off, let me say hello to Mike. Hi, Mike. I live in New York City, where it is possible to be approached by any number of people at any time of day! I have had MANY, MANY people approach me and ask me if I was Arabic. As a matter of fact, when I was in the Dominican Republic, the Dominican waiter asked me if I was Puerto Rican. You and I both know every ethnic group has no one set ‘look’, but nevertheless, I am always asked if I am of a certain ethnic group, whether it be Dominican, Indian, Puerto Rican, Arabic, etc.

    Second off, living in New York, it is possible to be spoken to in a foreign language at any time of day! I pity you. You must live in a sheltered little town where everyone speaks English. Of course, the notion of speaking a foreign language in America is alien to you, my sheltered friend!

    Thirdly, being JEWISH has no set ‘look’. You can be an African Jew, and still be JEWISH. You can be an Asian Jew, a Polish Jew, a Russian Jew. Any ethnicity imaginable can be Jewish (it is a religion). I don’t know where you’re going with the Jewish comment because the person walking down the street with drealocks, dark skin and a knitted Jamaican cap can be Jewish. You might want to think before you insult someone like me who has the goods to back up what I say.

    I know what I know. I know that I am of absolute Sicilian descent on both sides of my family. I know that I am dark skinned. I know that Sicily has been conquered again and again over the course of history. How is it you are all saying we aren’t African, Spanish, Greek, Arabic, among others (Norman, Lombard, etc)? You would have to be a fool to deny the blood rushing through your veins from all the people who have conquered our island. How could it be these people came to our land and left without breeding with the Sicilians who were already there? It’s impossible. You’re all a beautiful mixture of many cultures. Learn to live with it. Love it. You can be the fairest of the fair or the darkest of the dark, but you can still be Sicilian. Different families have different ancestry. I have good reason to believe my families are of Moorish and Arabic descent, but I know of Sicilians who look like they could have been Normans or Lombards. Accept it.

    I don’t appreciate Mike’s smug comments at all. And I would like an apology. How rude of him to come on here and accuse me of lying.. when I know what I know about myself and the people who interact with me!

    Bless you all.

    9/11/2004 11:21:06 PM

  33. People ask me if im morrocan, pr, or mid eastern lots of times! yet im full blooded southern catanian! 1st generation american! i been poisting pics of very ambiguos south italians and sicilians for a very long time! and oh greco-roman thats rm medhammer he thinks basques and sicilians are the same race! when infact basques are more purely european then sicilians! sicilians are mixed greek, arab, moorish berber, some african, some norman lombard, sicani, siculy, and elymi! some sicilians look whiter then others and others look more ambiguos to non white then others! we are mixed period! i dont consider myself white i look totally differnt from white people(north and central europeans) Ciao

    9/12/2004 12:48:47 AM

  34. audra.. mike doesnt known shit! and neither does beppe and greco-roman! to me you are a beautiful saracenic arab godess! una faza una raza

    9/12/2004 12:54:03 AM

  35. @ Audra

    >>> I have had MANY, MANY people approach me and ask me if I was Arabic.

    There aren’t enough Arabs anywhere in the U.S. for that. People mistake others for ubiquitous ethnicities that they expect to encounter, not total wild cards.


  36. ‘Antonino Morello’ writes:
    >>> People ask me if im morrocan, pr, or mid eastern lots of times!

    That’s because he probably is all of those things. Anyone who knows him at all knows that he has zero credibility. Here’s just a sampling of his dishonesty and ignorance:


    And his friend ‘honorable Boso’ is no different. The photos on his site are carefully selected (mostly by ‘Morello’), but he couldn’t find enough “nonwhite” southern Italians to make his “point”, so he uses mainly people who are indistinguishable from northern Italians, as well as a few who aren’t even Italian. Also, his statistics on the southern Italian economy are outdated and inaccurate:


    Neither of those two are to be trusted or taken seriously.

  37. I never said it was my natural coloring. A tan that dark isn’t my natural coloring (but it is for my brother, mom and dad) No need for personal attacks, Greco-Roman. All I’m saying is, even without a tan, I am darker than most ‘White’ people I know.
    And as a matter of fact, the Arabs were CELEBRATED in Sicily. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sicilian_language
    They brought with them artistic freedom, architecture, new foods, and a ‘progressive’ way of thinking.
    See for yourself. About ‘breeding’ with people that are scared of you, take a look at the American old west. Many, many people are of Native American and ‘white’ descent because of this.

    If I’m not mistaken, didn’t I see you on the Giusepoli forum, and weren’t you nice to me? Where did we go wrong? People get so heated over this topic.. it’s crazy. I don’t want to start any fights. We’re all human and we should all act civil towards one another, but some of you just need to cool it with the personal attacks on here!

    When I look in the mirror, I can see that there is NO way I have no Arabic or Moor in me.

    And about the reason I believe I am of that descent is because generations and generations ago, my mother’s family were the Arabs that came to Sicily. Gee, now you seem kind of taken back, don’t you? And my last name, DI FALCO, is Spanish in origin… YET I am Sicilian. Weren’t the Spaniards in Sicily? Look up my last name. Think about it.

    9/12/2004 9:00:26 AM

  38. Moderators, please delete the posts by ‘Antonino Morello’, especially the ones where he impersonates me. And then ban that little idiot. He’s ruining this thread.

    @ Audra

    >>> A tan that dark isn’t my natural coloring (but it is for my brother, mom and dad)

    Don’t be ridiculous. In the photos I saw, they were in some tropical locale, and their skin was ORANGE. That’s not their natural coloring, unless they’re part Oompa-Loompa or something.

    >>> And as a matter of fact, the Arabs were CELEBRATED in Sicily.

    No they weren’t. Accepting cultural influences is not the same as “celebrating Arabs”. Islamic culture had an impact throughout Europe, but that didn’t stop Christian Europeans from wanting the invading Arabs and Turks out of their countries.

    >>> When I look in the mirror, I can see that there is NO way I have no Arabic or Moor in me.

    Yeah, I’m sure the fantasies you have while staring at yourself in the mirror are more conclusive than the mounds of genetic evidence to the contrary.

    >>> generations and generations ago, my mother’s family were the Arabs that came to Sicily.

    Where’s your evidence?

    >>> And my last name, DI FALCO, is Spanish in origin.

    There are many names that can be both Spanish and Italian, due to similarities between the two languages. That proves nothing. Anyway, it isn’t Spaniards I’m concerned with. They’re European Christians, and therefore compatible with Sicilians.

  39. Greco-Roman,
    Let’s just end this. I am not like Morello. He may be a nice guy (to me), but he can get annoying sometimes. This thread has gone down the drain because of stupid, insipid bickering like this which goes back and forth.

    You may not agree with me, but this is how I feel. I think that, in this day and age, NO ONE is of a ‘pure’ race anymore, so this fight is just stupid. It still boggles my mind how you would ever be able to explain Sicily being occupied by various people for thousands upon thousands of years, yet the population remiained ‘pure’. Nevertheless, I’ll say it again: I don’t think in this day and age, that anyone is of ‘pure’ blood, however politically incorrect it may be. We are all human. We should celebrate our differences, not argue over them. You have your beliefs and I have mine, and that’s that. Truce.

    PS- Don’t compare me to Morello. He and I are NOTHING alike.

    9/13/2004 7:39:35 PM

  40. Audra why allighn yourself with these fuking whitewashers? they trying to europeanize you and whitewash you! they are trying to steal your arabic and moorish and phoenician heritage! and are trying to whiten you! fuck them! yu hear me? dont listen to them! they are whitewashers! especially rm! yu arent as dark as me! but some of your features arent very european! i know a true white person when i see one! and you are NOT a true white! DEATH TO THE WHITEWASHERS Ciao!

    9/15/2004 1:22:50 AM

  41. I am also 100% Siciliano. My family on both sides came from Palermo and corleone. My families landed in New York and New Orleans and we now live in Texas. Living in Texas many people always ask me if I’m Mexican. People speak spanish to me all the time. I have no problem with this, while I also have no problem admitting our culture has arabic blood in it because it is true. Read any historic documentation and you’ll see. The ancient Etruscans were arabic and Greek. I had a physical last year and my iron came up low. They retested me and find out I have thalassemia minor. This is not dangerous, but I found it very interesting when my arabic physician informed be that this is a very common trait among all arabics and many Sicilians. Read into this what you may. buona notte, Siciliano numero uno.

    9/17/2004 12:11:11 AM

  42. Where are you people from??? Some of you should just stop writing. Audra, if you come from a place like NYC, you will find plenty of immigrants who come up to you left and right. Alot of them will think you’re one of them, then proceed to speak their native language, because it is easier for them than speaking English. They feel more comfortable that way if they think you’re like them. Don’t worry, it happens to me all the time too. You are by no means a liar, or making this up. I don’t know where some of the people on this forum come from. Penzu ca cci su tanti scavuni i puru schivazzi ca ni sannu nuddhu d’unni vinemu nuiautri ni nenti dî cosi sìculi.
    Alot of people think I look Egyptian because of my bronzed in the winter color. But I am true Sicilian, whatever that may be.

    Pi tutti li xicareddhi ca scrivunu ccà, Sicily has been the crossroads of the Mediterranean for thousands of years. The Phoenicians (Lebanon), the Greeks, the Saracens, the Muslims, the Moors, all kinds of Arabs, the Romans, the Albanians, the Turks, the Normans, the Gauls, the Austro-Barbarians, and all kinds of Spaniards from the Aragonese, to those of Catalan. Have I left anyone out? All have settled Sicily at one time. Some longer than others.

    Sicily was the melting pot of three continents for thousands of years. For anyone to say that Sicilians do not share African blood would be foolish. The Moors themselves were a Negroid-Caucasoid mixture, and they too landed on Sicily. Certainly there are Sicilians with blonde hair and blue eyes, but you could find the same thing in some MiddleEastern and Latin American countries where blood is mixed. Someone can have two dark parents, and come out blonde if you go back a generation and see there are three dark grandparents and one light. And so, this explains the diversity of Sicily.

    Pi chiddhi ca tizzuni ni stannu parrannu, no other part of the present Italy can claim these characteristics, other than possibly Sardinia, but they were less effected by the Turks and the Albanian invasio of the 1400s. To whom said that all of southern Italy witnessed the same history as Sicily is wrong. Yes, the Arabs passed through Naples and Calabria, Puglia, Basilicata, Molise, and maybe even Abruzzo, but this was merely for trade by sea-faring merchants. Never did these areas come under Arabic occupation. Sicily and the continental part of southern Italy, with those regions named above comprised at one time The Kingdom of the Two Sicilies. Like this, Naples became the hub for education, trade, and commerce for most of the southern part of Italy. This includes the region of which Naples lies (Campania), the southernmost part of the region of present day Lazio (Latium, of which Rome is the capital) which was part historically and linguistically of Campania, Basilicata (historically Lucania), northern Calabria (the toe), northern Puglia (the heel), and Molise and Abruzzo to the north on the eastern shore of this region. These areas were part of The Two Sicilies, and grew around the affairs of the kingdom’s largest continental city. And so, this region spoke Neapolitan, and its various dialects from all these regions. On the other side of the straight of Messina lies Sicily, the island itself. Trade, commerce, art, culture, education, and all things came from within Sicily. Because Sicily the island had more contact with the Arabs, and because the toe and heel of Italy were along the trade routes, the southernmost part of Calabria (the toe), and the southernmost part of Puglia (the heel), aligned with the island of Sicily, even though they are part of mainland Italy, and the northern parts of these regions align with Naples. Like this, the Sicilian language and the Arab ways spread to the southern parts of the toe and heel of southern Italy via Sicily, and as a result the Sicilian language is spoken on the island of Sicily, with the many inter-provincial dialects, in addition to those of its many satellite islands, and of southern Calabria and southern Puglia.

    But unlike southern Italy, Sicily actually lied under Arab occupation for centuries, and didn’t merely just have a couple Arab merchants pass through and decide to stay. Sicily is a unique place. From what I see from some of the writers here, they lack the mental capacity to digest all of the details. I would hope that before anyone else posts remarks that are ignorant, racist, prejudice, false, irrogant, ludicrous, or inflammatory, please visit the following Sicilian website of links that will help you better understand the history, culture, language, and aboveall people of Sicily!


    addiu pajisani

    9/17/2004 12:31:41 AM

  43. @ Consoli
    >>> The ancient Etruscans were arabic and Greek.

    That absurd statement alone discredits your views on the subject of Sicilian origins. Etruscans predated Arabs by more than 1000 years, and they never even spread as far south as Sicily.


  44. @ GrecoAncient Etruscans were from Asia Minor which is modren day Turkey and Greece and correect me if I’m wrong but Turkish peiople are considered middle Eastern. That is not so absurd.

    9/17/2004 1:37:49 PM

  45. I always thought Moors were ‘black’….? At leat that’s what books tell you! Weren’t Moors African slaves to the Spaniards at one time?

    9/17/2004 4:16:36 PM

  46. @ Consoli
    You didn’t say ‘Middle Eastern’, you said ‘Arabic’. Big difference. Asia Minor is not now nor has it ever been Arabic, and it certainly wasn’t part of the Middle East in antiquity. The region, originally called Anatolia, wasn’t settled by Turks

  47. @greco
    So what are you saying? you are willing to except that we have middle Eastern blood running through our veins but not arabic? –Have you even researched thalassemia minor? I have read every one of your posts in this forum, its obvious you think

    9/19/2004 1:51:32 AM

  48. Well all of you im a Saudi Arabian and i am WHITE. I have been all over america and have had prejudice from Negroes and mexicans calling me Honky and trailer trash, and if i should hate anyone its blacks and Latinos! Im not Blonde but Blondes are not more white than Dark haireds!!! Caucasians are whites,like blacks are negroes. Dont confuse Celtic and germanic types for whites, hair eye and skin tone have nothing to do with being white. Blacks like to try and divide the white race because they hate british americans for enslaving them! When we arabs were the first to enslave and free Blacks. This is why you can see many chocolate brown arabs, because of race mixing!!!! Do pasty mongolians say oh! were really oriental and thai people are not oriental because theyre chocolate brown!!!! Modern I talians are as mixed as any nationality. I England youll find celtic looking people, Nordic looking people anglo-saxon looking people, but theyre all caucasian. If you see a guy thats chocolate colored hes not an arab, hes mixed!!! In Saudi my country we have been bastardized by east african imigrants and now my country is 50% black and mongrelized!!! Because Islam teaches racial tollerance its ruining the indigenous middle eastern people. We will always call ourselves WHITE WE dont care what some celtic or anglo-saxon says!!! Shannon Elizabeth is of arabic origin is she negroe? I dont think so!!! Oh and by the way north africans do not look the same as east mediterranean arabs because theyre blood lines are french, spanish, berber, and alot of east african negroes(conscripts during the moorish invasions). And by the way do you know the prophet Mohammed had red hair and light skin!!!!!! We are not Negroes ever!! And also Im sick of seeing some Paki or Hindi Chocolate colored asian playing an arabic man in movies. I am comfortable in france spain portugal yugoslavia, romania…… Only pasty northwestern europeans will ask if im french or swiss or hungarian etc…When in France i met some morrocan guys and they asked where i was from i spoke back to them in arabic, and the idiots said how do you know arabic. I answered firmly because i am arabic not a mongrelized person like you! 100 years from now do you think they wont be lots of mongrels on the usa?!!! Its already started!! Oh and by the way i bet that guys physician was a paki not an arab!! The arabic world is 22 countries do you honestly think were all the same race or ethnic background? Sudan is an arabic country but theyre all negroes, as black as soot! President Assad of Syria is White! Sheik Jaber of kuwait is White! Primeminister Ayad of Iraq is White! Queen Rania of Jordon would be called a cracker if she walked down Harlem!!!! The Fact is The True Arabs from the Near and middle east have had Black slave for centuries!!! Did you think when they were freed they all went bcak to africa? NO!! THEY Dam STAYED And BRED! Oh and an olive or fair or ruddy complexion does not make a caucasian more or less white!!!!! Look up the word caucasian in a dictionary it include siberians, eurasian, and middle easterners, not just europeans, otherwise tennis star sharapova wouldnt be white!!!
    And the “arabs” that were in sicily were libyans who look different from middle easterners cos thay have nappy hair and wide noses check out Colonel Gadafi.
    Italians are originaly romans, slavs, germanics and gallic peoples, italy is of modern day borders. They are all WHITE!
    Bottom line Buy an encyclopedia and a dictionary cos i can spot a negroe, mongrel, or a north african from 200 metres in my country!

    9/19/2004 6:05:42 AM

  49. @ Consoli

    >>> So what are you saying? you are willing to except that we have middle Eastern blood running through our veins but not arabic?

    Why don’t you actually read and try to understand what I wrote about ancient Anatolia, instead of asking du

  50. @Greco
    I went back and read some previous quotes and researched it real quick(i don’t have a lot of time)but your points are well taken. I think we are closer to agreeing on some issues than I originally thought. To me it sounds like we might be splittt

    9/19/2004 10:34:21 AM

  51. >>> To me it sounds like we might be splittting hairs a bit when it comes to the origin of Turkish, middle Eastern and Arab blood.
    Not at all. Arabs and Turks are historical groups with specific origins in Arabia and Central Asia. ‘Middle Eastern’ encompasses a broader geographical and temporal range but is used by most as a synonym for ‘Arabs and Turks’ (that’s how you’ve been using it). The only “Middle Eastern” blood that Europeans have comes from prehistoric settlements. Read this:


    >>> However I still have a little trouble with Thalassemia trait. I believe this trait was passed on to our people from anyone of the arab/middle eastern/turkish-Anatolian ancestors.

    Thalassemia dates back to prehistory (see above). How could Arabs or Turks have transmitted the trait to Southern Europe when it’s been present there since the Mesolithic period?

  52. Yes WhiteArab,
    I am from Jordan, and i am blonde, blue eyed, light skinned, slightly swarthy. And i am sick of poeple refeering to arabs like theyre not caucasian they obviously have never travelled to the middle east cos they seem to think were black or something, when we look like and mediterranean type.
    I went to america on holiday last year and they were shocked when i said i was arabic, many think we look like south asian indians or some think were negroes. Dont they understand that we have lots of negroes living in the middle east?
    You only have to look at the face of the sphinx in egypt to know weve always been caucasian.
    I went on holiday to hong kong and some people called me a gwei lo which aparently means old ghost? (white man)
    When i was in america i watched this show called MONK, a detective in chicago i think and he was played by an arabic-american Tony Shalhoub. He was playing an english-American!
    I wonder if people know that bin laden is part negro or do they think hes an original arab?
    Or that generally arabs dont wear turbans its eurasians like afghans and indians that wear them. He wears one because he was kicked out of arabia and wears what the afghans wear now. Ive been to europe also and they consider me white because thats what i am!!!!!

    9/21/2004 4:07:35 AM

  53. @Greco
    I finally read all of your documentation from Angel town. It was very intersting. If that website is indeed factual then everything you have said to this point is true. I owe you an apology–by the way the Italian Festival of Houston is coming

    9/21/2004 9:27:31 AM


    9/22/2004 3:36:56 PM

  55. “south euros” like greco-roman are all wanabee pure euros! they wish they had pink lilly white skins and blonde hairs and blue eyes and they wish they looked north european! why? because north euros are the purest whites europeans!! so they wish they can be pure white european like they are! so when a study finds negro genes in say… portugese or finds berber blood they deny it and try to find mongoloid dna in north europe to make themselves “whiter” then them! the main fact is that north euros are the EPITOME of whitness or europeaness no matter which fuking way yu cut it!! hallstatt nordics and ups are as ultra european as it gets! so no matter how fuking hard rm, alex, and the other paranoid insecure south euros try ! they try as they may they still cant be the same as a real truely pure european( a north euro)! so just accept the fact that you guys will never look like a true white! irish swedes russians poles dutch danes and scotsmen are all 10 times more european looking then south europeans! south europeans can pass for north africans and mid easterns plenty of times! the same cant be said for north euros! so yu can try to be white or pass as white ! but the fact remains……………. north euros will always be much much much whiter and much more ultra european looking then you ! this is why i post here! because i dont want south europeans to be the same race as north euros! they are more similar to north africans then to north euros! 2 eyes can tell you this! nick turturro and enrico lo verso can pass for non european not north european! but north europeans almost always look white and very white! and never look ambiguos(only in the most rare cases) so sorry to break it to you but you guys will never be pure white! stop trying so hard! accept your exoctic strains!! and dont whitewash north africans and arabs just cause you guys have arab and moorish strains! arabs and berbers are NON EUROPEANS NON WHITE! ONLY A FEW LOOK WHITE! once yu realize that your not purely european yu can feel much better! cause when its too white then it aint right! when something looks too european it looks ugly (hallstatts and ups are prime examples of this) LOL! just accept that your south europeans can look ambiguos white and non white! but never purely all white like north euros! thats all

    9/22/2004 8:54:32 PM

  56. “Tony Morello” is really a black New Yorker with a passionate hatred for whites, particularly Southern Europeans, more specifically Italians. He’s a well known fake and a phony who has been spamming the “Racial Myths” message boards for years. Everybody who frequents such message boards knows it very well. The readers from this forum are invited to ask all the regulars at:

    what they think of this hilarious clown.

    9/23/2004 5:22:37 AM

  57. Hi All,
    Im an englishman and i have dark brown hair and eyes as a large number of north euros do. I am an anthropology major and it may be a suprise but the white race does not really exist. There are only 5 racial groups and under that there are ethnic subgroups. They are caucasoid, negroid, australasoid, americanoid, and mongoloid. Each group has variances in skin tone, negroids vary from light brown to deep blackish brown, mongoloids vary from pasty snow white to chocolate brown, and similarly caucasians vary from pasty ruddy to very swarthy, etc..
    There are variances in hair and eyes tones amongst all racial types innuit indians and mongolians have been know to possess very light blue-brown eyes, whilst possessing no racial admixture, and merely melanin adaptations to climate. Darker skins will gradually fade lighter in darker climates and lighter skin will darken over time in warmer climates.
    Ultimately it is inaccurate to determine an ethnic background on skin tone alone. Autopsys in the past have resulted in false assumptions like in the IRA kennedy case where a man was ethnically selected as spanish but was actually an irish man, therefore the only definative way was to use facial structure and skull structure to make accurate conclusions. It is a common mistake that people associate curly or even wavy hair with negroid blood traits, however it has no bearing on whether someone is caucasian or otherwise. Facts my fellow posters will always triumph, racial propaganda is prevalent in history, from the creation of a jewish race to north africans claiming to be of arabic descent to mexicans claiming to be of iberian spanish origin. Lies and propaganda perpetuated throughout the ages will never count for scientific fact. That is why most governments are learning that all caucasians can be considered white and that all negroids can be considered black.

    Conclusion and Definitive outcome;

    Main Entry: Cau·ca·sian
    Pronunciation: ‘ko-‘kA-zh&n, -‘kazh-&n
    Function: adjective
    1 : of or relating to the white race of humankind as classified according to physical features
    2 : of or relating to the white race as defined by law specifically as composed of persons of European, No. African, or southwest Asian ancestry —Caucasian noun

    Source: Merriam-Webster Medical Dictionary, © 2002 Merriam-Webster, Inc.

    Ne·groid ( P ) Pronunciation Key (ngroid) Anthropology
    Of or being a major human racial classification traditionally distinguished by physical characteristics such as brown to black pigmentation and often tightly curled hair and including peoples indigenous to sub-Saharan Africa.

    source:The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
    Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
    Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

    Mon·gol·oid ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mngg-loid, mn-)
    Anthropology. Of or being a major human racial classification traditionally distinguished by physical characteristics such as yellowish-brown skin pigmentation, straight black hair, dark eyes with pronounced epicanthic folds, and prominent cheekbones and including peoples indigenous to central and eastern Asia.

    Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
    Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
    Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

    Aus·tra·loid ( P ) Pronunciation Key (ôstr-loid)
    adj. Anthropology
    Of or being a human racial classification traditionally distinguished by physical characteristics such as dark skin and dark curly hair, and including the Aboriginal peoples of Australia along with various peoples of southeast Asia, especially Melanesia and the Malay Archipelago.

    Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
    Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
    Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

    Native American Or Ameri.can.oid
    A member of any of the indigenous peoples of the Western Hemisphere.

    Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
    Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
    Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

    FACT, not Falsehood.

    9/23/2004 3:30:16 PM

  58. “AnthropologyMajor” said:
    > Autopsys in the past have resulted in false assumptions like in the IRA kennedy case where a man was ethnically selected as spanish but was actually an irish man, therefore the only definative way was to use facial structure and skull structure to make accurate conclusions.

    How can facial and skull structure differentiate a Spaniard and an Irish man when both groups are Caucasians? You would have to rely on whether the man’s skull was Mediterranean, Nordic, Alpine, Dinaric, etc., and that would still not solve the problem, as you can find all those Caucasian types in Spain and the British Isles.

    9/24/2004 12:51:03 AM

  59. I meant what you have just said, that trying to create defined sub-groups of any kind of caucasian is and always will be flawed. Saying that all spaniards are swarthy is flawed, saying that all russian slavs have larger heads and cheekbones is flawed, saying that all arabs are dark haired is flawed. Autopsys currently do not use skin eye and hair tone to determine ethnicity as it is flawed. They only use one of the five proven racial classifications. Also some of the posts are highly misinformed or extremely ignorant, on modern day ‘arabs’ and ‘hispanics’, neither of which are considered as races or ethnicities to a large extent, but culturally, historically, and linguistically linked. Spaniards are from iberia and has been indigenously populated by caucasians, in the same way arabs are from the eastern mediterranean (specifically northern arabia and parts of the southern fertile crescent. The arabs were originally and still are caucasian. However with both of these cultures embarking historically on conquest their language, culture, and religious views were imposed on the conquered populations. Even taking into acount rapes and intermarrige the existing populations were largely unchanged and in caucasian cultures the changes were unnoticable. Recent tests of morrocans show that less than 10% of the populace share ethnic traits with the original eastern arabs, but show predominantly berber, vandal, and abyssinian (a negroid sub group). Likewise tests of mexican have showed little similarity between their historical Spanish conquerers. Historical research supports genetic testing in that invading armies of spaniards numbering a few thousand and arabic armies number a few thousand supported by large numbers of abyssinian conscripts (enslaved or converts to islam).
    A great resource ive found on histories influences on race, culture, and etnicitiy can be found at http://www.whitehistory.com. I provides alot of supporting data, which is very improtant when making accurate assessments.

    9/25/2004 11:27:27 AM

  60. AnthropologyMajor said:
    >A great resource ive found on histories influences on race, culture, and etnicitiy can be found at http://www.whitehistory.com.

    Isn’t that the site that has Arthur Kemp’s “March of the Titans”? Come on, that “book” is a joke! The guy claims the Egyptians were “whites” and “ruled by Nordics”, yet at the same time foolishly claims the Moors were “part black, part mixed-race”, which goes against any legitimate anthropological survey of North Africa. He also claims modern Italy is a “biracial” country, with a white population in the North and a “mixed-race” population in the South, and he goes on and on with similar uncorroborated nonsense for other Southern European countries, which are the main target of his transparent Nordicist agenda. The man is a discredited amateur. Go to the Stormfront forum, where he posts regularly. His bullshit has been challenged and refuted over and over again.

    9/26/2004 3:06:00 AM

  61. I am Sicilian American I frequently get mistaken for a mixed race hispanic or light black. I’m proud of my Siclian looks. This Greco-Roman guy needs to stop denying the mixed types of Sicilians. He’s probably a blond Siclian guy who doesn’t like to admit that some Sicilians are mixed race!

  62. Thomas,
    I am sorry ive made a mistake it seems as though that url is being used by the stormfront now, but was used by a post grad i met in London. It was a very good site before with lots of academic research. Please accept my apologies for this error and i meant no insult to you or anyone in this archive.
    Oh by the way for anyone whos interested there are many examples of negro-caucasian mixes in almost every nation in europe, middle east, and north africa. Larger numbers in the nothern european nations now too and growing. Check out Soccer star Henrik Larsson a fair haired swedish-nigerian cross.

    9/27/2004 8:56:48 PM

  63. I just came across this thread today, but I would like to add my experiences with people.
    I am 100% Calebrese. People that I’ve met have asked me if I was Portugese, Arab, Lebanese, Greek, Jewish, and Persian. Now, I’m not saying I have any of these ethnicities in me, but the reality is many Italians look similar to other ethnicities, and it’s only natural for others to be interested in that and ask. Greco Roman is right—there currently is no proof that there is a huge amount of African ancestry in Southern Italy. But it doesn’t matter; you don’t have to actually BE part “black” to enjoy the fact that you might look it.

  64. To Stephania,

    Just to clarify that Lebanese are arabic, but they also have phoenician ancestory too.
    In addition you made a very good point about many asking if you are of various ethnicities, but the main line of these assessments are of various types of caucasians. I myself as an englishman have been asked in the past whilst on my travels if im italian, french, hungarian, swiss, arabic, portugese, croatian, etc..
    And im an englishman with a traceable anglo-saxon line.
    On the flip side if a negroid person went to sub saharan african countries they might be asked if theyre ugandan, sudanese, cameroon, zulu, swazi, etc…
    Bottom line, in the current climate of globalisation humans are finding it necessary to group and sub group each other under the assumption that people will behave or look stereotypically.

    10/2/2004 8:44:47 PM

  65. This was a discusiin for Sicilian people. We were expessing how we felt about our background, not all of us agree, but that’s the beauty of our culture and background. There is much written proof about our arabic heritage (viaggia.com has some decent stuff, but there are also many other valid sites and textbooks. I’m not sure how this branched out to anthropolgy majors and others. We understand we have arabic in our blood line. We appreciate your insight and interest in the subject, but really we don’t need some Englishmen who claims they are an anthropology major to quote web sites that no longer exist to prove a point that we have already made time after time. Go show off and try and impress people on some other site. As for the people on this site we can attest to– La Cosa Nostra– Sempre Sicliano. Arrivederla

    10/2/2004 10:03:27 PM

  66. Consoli,
    Please do not show prejudice and contempt to my background as i do not show it to yours. I have come to sites like this because it is my area of study. And as a neutral person who is learning fact based information, as oposed to hear say, propaganda and random people’s poor ethnic assessments.
    Sites such as these show a clearly misinformed and uneducated understanding of history and background. If a person says someone looks negro, it doesnt mean they are negro. It is the person that is mistaken, not facts that are mistaken.
    If ten people say ‘oh this guy i met looks chinese’, but the guy is actually from Peru, does it make him chinese?
    Finally you have not understood that arabic blood lines actually refer to people from the nothern arabian peninsula and the southern fertile cresent. Where sicily was invaded by north africans. North africans who had become arabic speaking because of conversion to the islamic faith. Because of this, modern day north africans possess a dialect and culture distint from their original arabian conquerers. So when you say you may have arabic blood lines you are incorrect, it would be berber and/or vandal or east african abyssinian traits.
    You must understand that conquest doesnt mean anhilating the indigenous people or marrying each one of them, it is a central governmental power as opposed to a racial one. Most conquests number only a few thousand soldiers not a mass exodus of people to a new land. Think about it there were no cruise liners or passenger airlines or airports. Most people move for a reason, soldiers go for power, but civilians dont move for no reason. Please read some history books.

    10/3/2004 10:21:47 PM

  67. Below I have included two links, showing the typical difference between an arabic north african, and an original eastern arab;
    This link is a picture of maroccan soccer star Hadji, you will be able to see he does not entirely possess caucasian traits. And may somewhat resemble some sicilians. As it was north africans that invaded sicily, and is in close proximity.


    This next link shows president Assad of syria (typical of an eastern Arab), you will notice his traits are distinctly different from a north african, possessing clearly identifiable caucasian traits.


    This fact is probably why ive seen many posts by eastern arabs complaining at being associated with north africans. The difference is clear to anyone that has travelled.

    10/3/2004 10:54:44 PM

  68. Like wise the same mistake is made when refering to people as ‘hispanics’. The following two links show the typical difference between the original iberian spanish person, and a latin american mexican.
    This link shows prsident zapatero of spain, clear identifiable caucasian traits.


    This link shows a mexican woman, clear identifiable americanoid traits, or aztec more specifically.


    Conquest doesnt always result in replacement or mongrelising of the indigenous peoples.

    10/3/2004 11:10:19 PM

  69. Boy this is the weirdest site. I always thought american were supposed to be smart, but you all proved that wrong. None of you have clearly been to europe, otherwise you’d realise that the majority of europeans are dark haired and dark eyed ive been to germany poland spain czech republic, all over and the most of us are dark only maybe england or sweden have more blonde & red heads. This post makes americans look third world dumb.

  70. –Anthropology major
    I respect your opinion you seem to have done plenty of research.


    Why are you reading and posting if you are so much better than us. The majority of Americans have dark hair and dark eyes also. What the hell does that

    10/8/2004 10:17:35 PM

  71. of course we sicilians have arabic genes! arabs ruled sicily for over 400 fuking years

    10/11/2004 2:17:31 AM

  72. Ive been to palermo, sicily and all of them are caucasian i did not see any negro there. Also its true that eastern arabs are caucasian, ive been to syria and israel, in america they could join one of your nazi groups, i mean they look totally white. In France there are many arabs and only the north africans look mixed. I noticed also above there was a post from a Saudi who is a ‘precious’ blonde you americans adore. Consoli, antonino proves my point about americans. Muslims from north africa ruled sicily, and back then muslims and arabs were the same thing, but today muslims are from so many different countries and cultures. Theres like over a billion muslims, and only 200 million arabic speakers, so use your brain.
    I checked out those pictures above and anthromajor proves his point, but hes a british guy not an american, hmm. Suprise.

  73. i am of sicilan desent and if there is one thing that i no no matter where i am or who i am with i am taking for purto rican and living in the bronx does not make it any easier for my identity i am not a racist but when people constantly take you for somthing other then what you are you do tend to get fed up ohyeah and to that french dude that don’t like americans it’s realize not realise peace

  74. to the sicilians yes you have black genes it is evident.with all due respect to greco roman please quote a site other than racereality i been there.if you beleive one site as truth then look at all the other links where researchers prove that sicilians indeed have melanin in there skins.the moors were black/arab mixed.hannibal was a nubian.there has always been an attraction between blacks and italians this is evident with all the half black/half italians in america.italians arent punks so they would have been have ran the moors out of sicily if they werent loved.it took 400 years?come on.i love siciians and wouldnt have even got involved in this conversation if you didnt disrespect the moors by calling them white.hate to make this a race thing but white people dont even like sicilians they cll yall spagetti eating niggers…dagos.so why are you trying to be them so bad?(not to all of you just the wannabes)in louisiana they hung sicilians along with blacks.they didnt even claim yall in fact the only reason they claim yall now is because of the sensus.yall arent white.sicilians are some of the most beatiful people on earth but the hatred against blacks and your own melanin is misplaced.after all of your racialreality site research white people still dont want you.hope i didnt offend anyone but i cant sugarcoat it.peace to you all

  75. I am Sicilian and I am surprised by the lack of human feelings found here. We are all from the Human Race although we do want to find our roots, it does not take all thoes mean words to discuss this subject. I have only learned of the Moors and am still unsure of the mixing of the blood lines. But ya know what, what ever I am I know I am of the Human race and if I be Sicilian & black what would be the big deal!! It’s all right! Calm down and get along! I am proud to be Sicilian and from the south as most Sicilians are! One more thing Italians & Sicilains are not the same. One is from Sicily and the other from Italy.I am Sicilian not Italian.

  76. I am Sicilian, who claims and excepts everything that I am mixed with. I myself, have medium brown skin, and black curly hair, just like the rest of my family. I do not consider myself white, and PROUD to say that. I am educated to the fullest about my ancestory and where I come from. Also, anyone who denies the BEAUTIFUL AFRICAN, and ARABIC culture that defines the Siciian/Southern Italian people should be ashamed! It just goes to show how IGNORANT people can be when it comes to race.

    11/29/2004 2:29:44 AM

  77. >>> with all due respect to greco roman please quote a site other than racereality
    Why? All of the data on that site comes from peer-reviewed journals.

    >>> researchers prove that sicilians indeed have melanin in there skins

    Um, everyone has melanin (what do you think moles are?). And sunlight causes the skin to produce more (what do you think tanning is?). Sicily has a very sunny climate.

    >>> after all of your racialreality site research white people still dont want you

    Who cares what “white” people want? I care about truth. And the truth is that Sicilians are not black. They look like this:


  78. This is an interesting one. Well im Sicilian and I can name about 15 people who asked me if I am Puerto Rican. After I tell them that Im Sicilian they say “O you’re Sicilian, thats Italian, your white, wow, I thought you were Puerto Rican”.
    Well the obvious truth is Sicilians arent italian, as a matter of face, EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT, even if they are both the same race/nationality. I dont know how many generations of humans have existed, im guessing around a few thousand maybe.

    Over these thousands of generations people from all over the world have been mixing from traveling, trading, exploring ect… Race (and especially nationality) is nothing to me, and the most pathetic term I know is “White”. White???? First off nobody is “White” not even albinos are “White”, white is a color, not skin tone, paper is white. I dont know how they even thought of white as a race, o well.

    Depending on what part of the world a group of humans were created at, has to do with how dark their skin color is. The closer to the equator, the darker. But due to mixing, dark and light people are all over. Places like Sicily and Puerto Rico has all different colored people nowadays, thats becaues MIXING. Sicily is very rich in resources, ive read that lots of people been there, like Greeks, Egyptions, North Africans, Spaniards, Italians, everyone (around that area). As for Puerto Rico, we all know whos been there, the native Puerto Ricans (Boricua), Spaniards, African slaves, mostly likely even more.

    So what im trying to say is, the word “white” is very confusing and shouldnt even exist, people are people.

  79. everyone is so quick to be white. i’m black and have the mixings, i had a problem with having white blood in me because white people were claiming anything that was good in their eyes (physical,intelligence anything we had. they believe they were giving us a gift. i don’t care anymore i see good in all people of different race. i feel secure within i feel good about myself i claim any admixture because it’s there.i believe white people envy other races but because they want to hold the title as being superior or physically more beautiful they tried to hide the fact. once you accept and move on, you realize how stupid the subject is.

  80. everyone is so quick to be white.i’m black with admixture (white),wasn’t proud of it because most white people were claiming anything they saw good in their eyes(light skin ,intellectual blah blah. i don’t care anymore, i feel secure within myself. i believe white people envy what other races have just as, but they would not admit it, because they want to keep the title of being so untouchable, more physically beautiful than oh and more superior. it’s all about attention and feeling like a god. being looked at as if you are so lucky to have what you have and that person is lacking. the subject is interesting but stupid at the same time. but it should had never been an issue, when people walk and talk and do everything as human, we’re all the same inside get over your insecurities or high horse. typical

  81. hi everyone, well ive never seen a sicilian that didnt look white. I do believe that they may have 1% or 2% mixed. Ive seen sicilians of ALL coloring. My friend has blonde hair,tan, and blue eyes. My other one has bright carroty red hair green eyes and pale(strangely though, no freckles). They are both 100% scicilian, both of friends’ parents immigrated from sicily. Then again there are also brown eyed black haired sicilians like my english profesor. They are definitely one of the most diverse group of people when it comes to looks. I also get mistaken when it comes to my identity, Im a 50% albanian(dad) & 50% nigerian(mother) but everyone thinks im irish or scottish because i’ve got reddish brown hair,relatively fair, with freckles, and blue-green eyes. Then again like italians, albanians vary in looks because where im from(detroit) nearly all albanians are from montenegro and they can be very dark(hair,eyes,skin) whick i think may be due to mixing with the serbs,possibly gypsies,etc. unlike albanians from albania or kosova where they are very pale and hair/eye color varies. The same goes for blacks, they come in all shades including high yella, red bone, chocolate brown(my mom =)), light brown, and even blue-black. one more thing,I do agree with the post above because I hear all these whites saying that im lucky because i got all the caucasian feature, in my opinion i wouldve rather gotten at least some more of the african features. I dont think its right that whites make themselves more superior to other races. The funniest thing is when WNs try and explain why many other races are smarter than them or how the only reasons many blacks are smart is because of white admixture which is complete BS. WNs also think that men of other races want their women.Take a look at history, white men were known for raping their black slaves or raped native american women.they try and make it sound like blacks are trying to look like them, such as whitening products but take a look at what whites are trying to do to achieve their features such as tanning, lip injection, butt implants, perms,etc. but overall were all human and we should all be treated this way.

    2/5/2005 1:45:51 PM

  82. I am 100% sicilian from Brooklyn and now live on Long Island. Ive read everyone on this site. Mike Vincenzo and g are all ignorant and time and time again the people on here dont back up what they are saying with evidence. Greco Roman coulnt`t be more right. Siclian people are white There was minimal mixing over the course of centuries. If you people really take the time and research it who`ll find the real genetic markers and genes in sicilian blood. I think Greco ROman has done a great job in trying to explain this to you people. Some people on thiss site are like wannabe arab, africans, its so sick. Nothing against these people but when people arent something and have this weird buring desire to be somthing there not. Im a history major and take much pride in my sicilian roots.Some of you people are real sick

  83. Joe is absolutely right. Natives of Mediterranean coastal areas are Caucasoid even if some have dark complexions. Going back to early history, about 4000 BC many people now called Arabs had the same remote origins as the majority of other ancient Eastern Mediterraneans who eventually populated Greece and Italy. Interpretation of genetic testing and known history indicate few substantial differences among ancient Cretans or ancient Anatolians. Sicilians are descended from both groups. A recent National Geographic article on the Phoenicians discussed this. But let’s not get obsessed with this race thing and try to be humans first.

  84. Both my parents are Italian and I am proud of my heritage, but for every one wondering if we have someAfican in us the answer is yes we have but not just Italians, but every other nationality as well!
    You see man first evolved in Africa about 400 million years ago, they were called “Homo Sapiens” and they
    were the first thinking man that evolved from the ‘Homo erectus’ which were the first upright man, any other human like species before are not direct ancestors of modern humans. ‘Homo Sapiens’ fgssils have been found in Europe and Western As
    and Western Asia. About 100,000 years ago a newer type of human the ‘Homo Sapiens Sapiens’ developed in
    Africa and spread to other continents.

    8/19/2005 9:51:53 AM

  85. Im 100 percent sicialin and have light skin and freckles…dirty blonde hair..
    most southern italian and sicilians i know are light skinned and have light eyes
    blue or green…I’m not saying that there arent many olive skinned southern
    italian but there are at least if not more fair complexion southern italians..

    Comment by j russo — 10/25/2005 @ 2:43 am

  86. How many of you have been to Sicily?

    Sicilians are descended from a mix of peoples, mostly white.
    They look sort of Greek-Italian. They are most DEFINITELY white.

    The Spanish are also white, but they have a stronger Moroccan influence – i.e. more Arabic.

    If you’re Italian, and you get mistaken for a “non-white”, it’s probably because
    1. You live in a sunny country, like.. hallo??
    2. You live in a ‘new’ country, where very few have a clue which ethnicity matches which country. In old countries, it’s like always fun game to tell where a bunch of tourists comes from.

    Comment by AARGH — 11/3/2005 @ 5:36 pm

  87. When I studied in grammar school,I learned that there were SIMPLY two
    dominant races: black and white, and a third one mongoloid (northern and eastern Asia). Once I came to the United States from Puerto Rico, I was categorized as “hispanic” or “puertorrican” as a race. Never understood when this new category of racial identity was created. I am white caucasian, catholic and who happened to be born in Puerto Rico. Of course, early Puertorricans are of Spain ancestry. We are white and our dominant race is white. I still refer to me as white and not hispanic since hispanic is too broad and it includes
    native indians, white, mestizos, and black. Furthermore, the Puertorricans are different from the South Americans and Mexican descents. Why? Because Puerto Rico was infiltrated by French, American, Dutch, and Germans (at some point). So our ethnicity is like a rainbow: all kinds and colors; there are very few native puertorricans of indian descent; as it is the case of countries in South American and Mexico. So, when they ask my race, I simply say white – because it doesn’t matter where I was born, I would have been white no matter what.

    Comment by carmen — 11/16/2005 @ 6:39 pm

  88. hey i’m of spanish and Irish descent. am i considered white? please tell me its bugging me

    Comment by Pat — 11/24/2005 @ 12:32 am

  89. Hey I enjoyed reading the posts here and im glad that Scilians for the most part are proud of their heritage and not ashamed to say they have Arab blood in them, as it is fact Arab Muslims ruled Sciliy for over 200 years and also they ruled Spain and Portugal for around 800 years! which helped influence the European Renaisance as the rest of Europe was in the DARK AGES, it was Islam that brought light and knowledge to the rest of Europe – quite literally too since Al Andalus (Spain) was the first country to have public street lighting!

    Anyway u will see Islamic/Arabic architecture and foods in Sciliy and Spain, even King roger? i think employed Muslims to build islamic style buildings and even churches for him long after the Islamic rule had ended.

    for more info on Islam in general see http://www.islamonline.net


    Comment by Omar — 11/26/2005 @ 12:22 am

  90. I also think ‘GrecoRoman’ is in denial or just plain ignorant as he has tried so hard to dney and wipe out any sign of an Arab presence in the genes of the people of Sicily, even tho they ruled it, does he seriously think all that time like 200years the ppl would not have mixed? are u that silly?

    And for those who want to see some architecture in Spain and Sicily that came from the Arabs then chek the links







    http://www.cp-pc.ca/english/portugal/images/port22.jpg – Portugal here

    http://www.bestofsicily.com/mag/art168a.gif – Sicily here, do u see the ARABIC QURANIC writin


    Comment by Omar — 11/26/2005 @ 12:51 am

  91. Any in the Quran mankind as a whole are addressed as Bani Adam (Children of Adam) and the Prophet Muhammad said over 1400 years ago that white is not superior to black nor is black superior to white and arab is not superior to non-arab nor is non-arab superior to arab and we have all decended from Adam.

    Comment by Omar — 11/26/2005 @ 12:57 am

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